Comments and ideas for the measurement of Radon and radiation
Two SBM-20 in parallel and a GeigerAdapter form a simple probe, very sensitive and inexpensive.
This image shows a measure of environmental fund with Theremino_geiger
More information
– Software download: www.theremino.com/downloads/radioactivity
– Electrical schematics and Assembly plans: www.theremino.com/technical/schematics
– Hardware, DIY and kits: www.theremino.com/contacts/producers
– Images and videos: www.theremino.com/video-and-images
– Article about Open Source Electronics: it.emcelettronica.com/geiger-from-lab-sensitive-and-least-expensive
In the documentation folder (accessible from the Help menu) you will find all the information you need to use the program and probes.
The HAL program, required to connect to the Master, you download from here: www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations
Measure with Geiger
This image shows a measure of environmental fund 15 minutes, followed by the provision of a sample of dietary salt. At the beginning of each measure was pressed “Start”
Precision measurements you make with long integration time. While precision measurements you do not have to change the conditions of measurement. Move the samples during the measurement would be like taking a fever without taking the thermometer in the same spot for the three minutes required.
All ’ start of the measurement You should press the button “Start new measure” that is how “Reset the thermometer” Before measuring a fever. Without this initial zero setting it is likely that the fever has not indicated its, but someone else.
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To make precise measurements You must respect the agreements with the program, the instructions are explained, in detail, the procedures to be followed.
To make quick measurements, just set the “usual” 2 or 3 minutes of integration, using all portable geiger..
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Some users would like to avoid having to follow the measurement protocol. In essence they would like a button “Start” you press alone, any significant variation of the radioactivity.
Early versions of Geiger had this option, but we found that this made the measurements unreliable and bore, in some cases, completely wrong measures, without being able to inform the user ’ and without any possibility of control by software. These errors were not due to an inaccurate implementation of ’ algorithm, but are inherent in the measurement method and any appliance that is automatically reset can avoid them.
As far as l ’ algorithm is sophisticated and set the trigger thresholds, There are always a few sequences of changes that lead to a zero delayed, resulting in pollution of the first part of the buffer of integration, or to a non-zero or, even worse, to reset drivers, they do lose hours of data.
To miss any appliance that resets by itself, proceed as per the following example:
1) Let it settle to the bottom
2) Bring a sample very radioactive 20 cm so that it resets and empty the buffer
3) Continue moving the sample up to contact, but very slowly, so as not to over take the reset threshold.
The first part of the buffer will be filled with samples too low, the threshold it clicks more and the measure will continue to be systematically flawed, How long you have the patience to wait.
This example sequence is extreme, but there are many real opportunities to attract more or less large errors, If you allow ’ user to move samples at any time, or add and remove fragments in a sample already to an extent.
The devices designed for measuring “on the field”, where it is important to react quickly, are not suited to precision measurements and can, in many situations, provide incorrect measurements.
Measure with the ion Chamber
Ion Chamber documentation files do not show enough that, in some cases, the pulse rate can be very low.
In environments with little radon (d ’ summer with wind and opened Windows) Radon concentrations may fall under the 0.1 PCI/l (4 Bq/m3). In these cases, you get even less than one pulse every 5 minutes. It can also happen to not measure no pulse for ten or fifteen minutes. The randomness then back to place the media, concentrating many impulses in 10 minutes after. The next image shows this behavior.
In this picture have gone well 9 minutes, before receiving the first impulse. In the central zone is also a period of 15 consecutive minutes without pulses.
That is why we designed a very large room (from 1 liter). With many commercial appliances impulses would also 100 times less frequent. For example a “Safety Syren Pro3” (a few cubic centimetres), would produce on average, Pulse every 7 hours and could spend long periods, even more than a day, no pulse.
Test of Thoron
If you live in an environment with little radon, the low frequency of impulses might suggest a malfunction of the room. Fortunately there is a Thoron, a similar Radon gas, but much more convenient for testing. More information about the test of Thoron, on pages 21 and 22 of the document “Radon_IonChamberElectronics”, download from here: /hardware/inputs/radioactivity-sensors
In the first part of this picture you see the Environment Fund. In the second part the mantle containing Thorium was positioned in the saucer, and been pressed Start. In the third part, the Start button was pressed again and in a few minutes the measurement has stabilised at about 5 PCI/l. In just over half an hour ’ l ’ error fell to 10%.
The gas mantles containing thorium are not all the same and the room may not fill completely due to leakage between the saucer and the room. Then the measured value may be different, Come on 5 PCI/l of this picture.
If you measure from 2 PCI/l to 10 PCI/l the test passed, Otherwise please email us.
In this picture the mantle with thorium and saucer were removed. L ’ indoor air was grossly cleaned up, waving a cardboard for a few seconds. Then the Chamber was lying horizontally, so leave the holes open to both terminals and pressed the Start button. In just over half an ’ now the room is completely cleaned up and returned to 0.1 PCI/l.
The ion Chamber should always be handled with delicacy. The bursts of pulses that are produced when the room is shaken, mild vibrations are produced by central wire and do not indicate a malfunction. Even dust bunnies can cause bursts of pulses, You may need to add dust filters. Read pages 25 and 26 of the document “Radon_IonChamberElectronics”, download from here: /hardware/inputs/radioactivity-sensors
I did have a heart attack at geiger….I have problems about high counts.
When I approach the specimen at slung the tic no longer feels and looks like impallarsi the tutto.il sample is from about 1, 5Mrh
I attach the log “implallato”
arduino div counter
————————————-
Session started at: 2012/12/03 22:06:50
—————————————
FIR Seconds: 6000
Sensor type: Geiger
Sensor Sens.: 29.00
Sensor BKG: 0.20
Sensor Dead-time: 190
—————————————
DATE TIME CPM uS/h
—————————————
03/12/2012;22.06.50;00000,000;00000,010
03/12/2012;22.06.51;00180,103;00000,010
03/12/2012;22.06.52;00060,011;00000,966
03/12/2012;22.06.53;00060,011;00000,276
03/12/2012;22.06.54;00090,026;00000,276
03/12/2012;22.06.55;00060,011;00000,448
03/12/2012;22.06.56;00045,006;00000,276
03/12/2012;22.06.57;00048,007;00000,190
….
….
03/12/2012;22.27.14;00227,260;00001,238
03/12/2012;22.27.21;00227,034;00001,237
03/12/2012;22.27.21;00226,810;00001,236
03/12/2012;22.27.27;00226,585;00001,235
03/12/2012;22.27.29;00226,362;00001,233
03/12/2012;22.27.37;00411,126;00001,232
03/12/2012;22.27.37;00410,721;00002,294
Geiger doesn't go into crisis even with levels 1000 times greater than these 2 us/h, for him it's all numbers, whether large or small, does not change its workload.
Anyway just to be sure I tried with 10 thorium gas mantles and proceeded to other 150 us/h without any sign of fatigue and with the CPU all’ 1%
Most likely the serial line you are jamming, keeping open the “TaskManager” You should see the CPU rises to 100%
Maybe you could improve the situation by setting the maximum baud rate (115200) but, in any case, both the Theremino_Bridge that the Theremino_AudioInput are just replicate SideShow. The roads you are doing through the serial and audio are unnecessarily complex and can only create problems.
Also the power supply of the geiger tube of GeigerKIT doesn't fit the high voltage and not correct for variations due to temperature variation of component parameters, whereby the measured values will change over to the instability of the voltage on the tube that for real environmental changes that, I assure you, are minimal and measurable only with very long time. If you see something that changes from one minute to another is not the fallout but the feeder that moves or the randomness of the data not integrated with a suitably long time.
If you want to take good measures using a “Master” and a “Geiger_Adapter” that, together, costing half of what you bought so far and are simple small and reliable. On the master'll 6 generic pin InOut useful for making too many other applications and experimenting with all kinds of sensor.
Answer to your question about hardware
Should not get new hardware by ThereminoGeiger, now the Master and the GeigerAdapter are stable, machine products in thousands of copies and they go so well that probably will remain the same for many years.
Among other things there is still broken even one for which they are so sure of their reliability that guarantee I personally, send me any non-functioning modules and I'll fix them for free without asking the time or who bought them or else (but please don't give him the 220, shipping costs are your…)
Hello
Livio
PS: I reduced a little’ the size of your LOG to not stretch too much on blogs.
Try this it’ slightly improved and also shows the growing number.
https://www.theremino.com/files/Theremino_Bridge_1.6.zip
Try also to use 115200 How to BudRate and let me know how it goes.
Hello
Livio
Hello,Livio are still being tested….
Meanwhile, I ordered the master and geiger tabs but I have not found the stranded wire to connect the two ,then explain to me what's.
salutoni
The cables can be purchased here: http://www.hobbyking.com
The page of our website which speaks of the connecting cables are here: https://www.theremino.com/technical/connection-cables
About Geiger connections you can watch also here:
https://www.theremino.com/downloads/documentation/questions-and-answers
Information and features of the Master and GeigerAdapter are here: https://www.theremino.com/hardware/devices
in here too:
https://www.theremino.com/technical/schematics
For more information click on the button “Search” and then CTRL-F within each page.
Hello
Livio
Email sent
You're really damn cryptic… I think I understand you sent this request leads to Paul.
Yes, I forgot to order them,However I have seen that are suitable for those in the cabinet of the pc, We balance a stereo headphone type jack ,What do you think?
Cryptic? perhaps too telegraphic (deformation hobby craft).
Hello :-)
You will find him already’ welded by Paul….
Salve
I'd be interested in the construction of the Ion Chamber, is there any news?
Thank you
You should get to Alexis, Now you can inform you of your question….
Hi Mirko ,
the ion Chamber is testing for a couple of months , in general it works well I though’ problems when the humidity in the sense that changes me very incrementandole readings, I have to make some changes to the circuit.
If you want to participate in tests, We are happy to make you too.
I try to prepare a kit PCB schematics and pictures to anyone who wants to start experimenting.
Thank you very much.
I more than willingly!
I look forward to news.
Mirko
Alessio, gladly I would participate in the trial, too.
Monday or Tuesday I get the cards theremino.
This “zip” contains the original project (IN ENGLISH) and project files made by me and Livio
https://www.theremino.com/files/RadonDetector.zip
then came geiger with the master ,kill that little :-) .
I plugged in the probe ,I made the bridge on 400volt,I plugged the jack and the connector- in out pins-to one black wire to ground.
I put the cable on the usb port,Windows detects themerino install something and the Green led flashes fast, but
themerino geiger and don't click.
I skipped something?
but you have to connect the audio?
or just the usb?
I read https://www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations but ndostà…
No, You should not connect the audio, just the USB, look here how to links:
https://www.theremino.com/downloads/documentation/questions-and-answers
Then proceed to this list:
1) connect the master all’ USB
2) the master must blink fast
3) Download https://www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations from here: https://www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations
4) launch https://www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations
5) Select the line of pin and’ used as input ( from 1 to 6 )
6) in “PIN properties” Select “Pintype = Fast counter” and “Slots = 1”
7) minimize https://www.theremino.com/downloads/foundations but do not close it
8) launch Theremino_Geiger
9) in the tab “Options” Select “Sensor type = geiger tube used”
10) also in tab “Options” Select “Input = 1”
11) should now begin to click
12) close the analog meter and in laboratory not needed and it’ accurate
13) in the tab “Operation” Select “Seconds FIR filter = 9999”
14) place the sample and press “Starts a new measure”
15) wait until the reading stabilizes
16) each new measure press “Starts a new measure” and wait until the reading stabilizes.
If you can't call me at: engineering@theremino.com and give me a contact phone number,
or I'll give you my phone, or you can find me on skype.
Hello
Livio
all done I had already seen on the blog ,everything works ok
Thanks Livio
Who is Keith?
why when I try to run START.sh answer me access is denied?
Lucio-lucio at intel-intel:~ $ cd thereminoslot
Lucio-lucio at intel-intel:~/thereminoslot $ sudo bash START.sh
sudo: ./Theremino_Slots_C_Linux: command not found
"Hit_any_key_to_continue ___"
Lucio-lucio at intel-intel:~/thereminoslot $ chmod + x START.sh
Lucio-lucio at intel-intel:~/START.sh/thereminoslot $.
sudo: ./Theremino_Slots_C_Linux: command not found
"Hit_any_key_to_continue ___"
Lucio-lucio at intel-intel:~/thereminoslot $
Do you have to make it run on Linux? And’ all 4 times more’ hard, “n” times more’ buggy and I don't really know how to help you…. However, the alien in question is called Roberto, He immediately sent a message and we will respond as soon as possible, or write him at: development@theremino.com (If you then continue the discussion here is better for everyone)… I don't find Roberto but I could try to help you with an information: It seems to me that Roberto was about “SUDO” (symbolizing the sweat will have to spend to make it run on Linux but that it's also say something like “to become a supervisor”, or something, and then change the permissions)
I went looking for SUDO: …. allows users to run programs with the security privileges of another user (normally the superuser, or root) … Its name is a concatenation of the about command (which grants the user a shell of another user, normally the superuser) and “do”, or take action…
I noticed that you were already’ using “SUDO” so I take it back… I don't know how to help you, you will have to wait for Roberto.
my fault.
You have to go to the file, right click-Properties and set the Checkbox
making it executable.
Livio,I want to use ubuntu because it is your pc always on ,then to make the measures is great.
We are also looking at ways to publish the results on web sites ,the idea is to create a national network of detection.
And because’ ever the main PC (always on) should have Linux and therefore difficult to each installation, to save 30 euros of operating system ?
However I understand that it’ configured so and and’ better not change, I will try then to help as much as I can, but we understand little and Roberto is not.
Have you read the page on Linux tips?
I know this is not’ complete and right about Roberto should make valuable additions.
Now I try to call him again… He's not answering… We talk to you tomorrow, Hello.
With linux there work,unload all mail (25 account) with windows I made terrible experiences ,lost mail,schematics,customer profiling etc.. Because viruses of all kinds , now I use ubuntu and I ended up a nightmare.
Hello Livio
Never lost anything since Windows95 onwards, ever seen a real virus, just use the right antivirus, currently “Avast Freeware”
However it is right that everyone becomes stable in its own way, just that everything is working fine and then we're good. I just hope everything will unify, sooner or later, in a single operating system because this work double or triple is a huge waste of time for everyone. And, as if that wasn't enough, instead of unify, you keep making new operating systems, Android, FreeBSD, Leopard etc…
But also I have worked and work with windows ,still use it on laptops also because there is no software for my work that only run with him.
In my collection I have my first floppy disk dos ibm 5,25. and my first hd ibm 20 MB that is bigger than my laptop….
What is the maximum length of the cable between master and power supply module geiger?
And the type of cable?
It is possible to overcome the limits of USB cable length, for example with a USB-ethernet adapter?
Have you already tested in this sense?
Cable between Master and GeigerAdapter
———————————————————————————————–
The cable between master and geiger (According to calculations of capacity and rate of climb of faces) should do 500 m and above, also kilometres if necessary (with some tricks)
We tried only up to 30 meters with a network cable to 6 wires, but surely 100 meters makes them, even with the worst shielded 500 pF per meter.
But with such lengths you should pay attention to some things:
1) If you pass near strands of 220 You must use shielded cable (in fact I'd use it always over 10 meters)
2) The power supply must always come from the master through the cable. otherwise an external power supply would create a ring of such masses’ long to pick up everything and produce spurious pulses every time you turn on a light bulb or that Vatican Radio emits the time signal
I'd use a normal audio shielded cable with sheath + 2 internal wires (Maybe red and black or red and white)
Always using the same shielded cable with two wires inside it could increase the maximum distance horsing around (many kilometers) with a slight change to the output circuit of Geiger Adapter. This is to replace the output resistor 33 kohm with one from 470 ohm and then put a resistor from 1000 ohm between outlet and mass. In this way the output impedance is lowered to about 300 ohm resistor, suitable for normal shielded cables multirows seed drills. The voltage divider composed of two resistors need to lower 5 Volts of impulse up to 3.3 Volts, in order to avoid exceeding the 3.3 Volts with too much current (currents on the input pin until some but not break the PIC but if you exceed the 3.3 Volts with currents greater than 100uA USB communication is disturbed)
Maximum length of USB cable
———————————————————————————————–
I tried here in the lab with USB extension 10 meters + normal USB cable from 1.5 meters with a very old USB Hub (of those who do not bear the USB 2 but only the 1.1)
At the end of all this crock I connected 3 Master and worked, without problems, all together. (for the record the HAL program can also work with multiple masters)
Probably not all USB cables and USB extension cables have the same capacity, Some may only make 5 meters more maybe even 20. The USB specification advise against going beyond the 5 or 10 meters.
In each case a Master uses very little bandwidth USB (less than 100 kbit/s versus megabits/sec of a normal WebCam) so even with USB 1.1 travelling well.
About the analog instrument should have
(Thank you for making us discover his bug)
——————————————————————————————————————————————
Now the analog instrument should have Theremino_Geiger works fine, the bug is fixed and a little improvement made it more accurate when the Cps are very low. However it must be borne in mind that the analog instrument should have never exactly the same numbers will not mark the major scale because it is based on a very different operating principle.
The main staircase using a FIR filter (finite impulse response) with a length that grows automatically, as you increase the measurement time.
Instead the play upon using a FIR filter (infinite impulse response) with three fixed lengths, a few minutes, to simulate the behavior of an analog filter, to resistors and capacitors, to behave like a real instrument should have “vintage”
The instrument should have analog is better suited to respond rapidly in field research (search for minerals) but you cannot use it for precision measurements, in the laboratory it is better to close it.
Thanks for pointing this out, Livio.
Before you know what you wrote, observing the analog instrument, and comparing it to the chart, I didn't realize that the two signs are not consistent, and I understood that the difference was due to a different response of integration.
After your explanation now I understand even better how to use the three buttons ' slow, norm, fast '.
I think it would be useful to, for beginners and for those who cannot understand ' in eye’ What is the difference, Add in a chapter program manual analog instrument.
USB Extension Cable: I tried connecting with three active usb extension cables from 5 Mt, and it works. For the cable between Geiger Adapter and Theremino Master I tried 100 m of shielded cable 3 x 0.14 Unitronic Lycy of Lapp Kabel and works (capacity 120 NF/Km inductance and 0,65 MH/Km).
Thanks Dario!
Such tests are very useful and helps us improve the projects and adjustments for future projects.
In fact, geiger on terrace in a waterproof box ip65. The master module into the House in box special interconnected shielded stereo audio type. That way you could use other entrances to other things.
(If possible a temperature sensor,wind or other….. Geiger)
Kill that lovi disease geiger counters….
Besides connecting perimeter surveillance cameras if anyone has any geiger, You can use the slots were, as motion sensor, using the software Theremino Video Input.
Se qualcosa passa in una zona dell’immagine, da voi impostata nel software, si può far scattare un sistema di allarme.
ottimo per antintrusione notturna .
Questo è lo spirito del Sistema Theremino !
Ci sono 999 slot liberi – pronti per essere usati in 999 modi diversi
“Shortly publish the ThereminoGeiger Version 3.0 and instructions for building a simple ion chamber able to accurately measure amounts as small as hundredths of picoCurie.”
Is there any progress on the ion chamber design. I have purchased the Theremino Geiger kit circuits and would be interested in also building the Radon detector add on.
I have friends who will also be purchasing the Theremino Geiger Kit after showing it to them. Great kit.
Hi ,
this is a Radon Detector Project https://www.theremino.com/files/RadonDetector.zip
kind regards Alessio.
“Shortly publish the Theremino Geiger Version 3.0 and instructions for building a simple ion chamber able to accurately measure amounts as small as hundredths of picoCurie.”
Just wondering if there has been any progress with the design of a simple ion chamber, able to accurately measure amounts as small as hundredths of picoCurie.
Also the Theremino Geiger Kit is excellent, Have purchased 5 now for myself and friends. One suggestion would be to allow the Geiger alarm to be set lower than 1.0 uSv/hr. At present it won’t let you set it lower than that.
Here is a Theremino Geiger circuit kit + software K40 test chart, of 100 grams of pure Potassium Chloride, using a Russian SBT-10 pancake tube.
http://sccc.org.au/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/Theremino-Geiger-K40-test.png
Sorry didn’t see your previous reply. Thanks
Dear vital1
Thanks for testing and the ideas and images.
You’re right, the box “Alarm level (uS / h)” should have the digits after the decimal point.
We will correct this today, or tomorrow – in the version 4.4
Consider also that the all the Theremino System components can communicate between them with the easy “slot” concept. So the Theremino Geiger can send the measured radiaton value to a slot and other programs like ThereminoScript or MaxMSP or PureData can do anything with this value. Also if they are located on another computer, via local net or Internet.
It is also possible tu run multiple copies of the application Theremino Geiger (each one must be in a separate folder to maintain saparate parameters) All the apps can read the same sensor from the same slot but each application can be “specialized” for a different work. For example one application can make a continuous survey with a FIR integration time of 60 seconds, the alarm and the log always active, while another application can be used to make tests with radioactive samples, using the max integration time to get the max precision.
I have some important tips for you.
1) The version 3.7 contains errors in the analog meter, if you download the latest versions you’ll see that the analog meter works much better and its indications are more similar to those of the main scale. (although you should consider the analog meter works on different principles, to be fast)
2) – IMPORTANT –
You should not use integration times short as 60 seconds. This severely limits the precision and should only be used for environmental control equipment, working continuously without operator.
For laboratory measurements you should ALWAYS set the maximum time – 9999 seconds – and press “Start new measure”, after any changes in the measurement conditions.
This is explained also in the help file of the program.
In the latest versions the help file is improved and in a few days it will be translated in English.
bye
Livio
Dear vital1
The new Theremino Geiger Version 4.4, with the alarm level configurable to suit your needs, is ready to download.
Please read the Help file, the next days we will translate it in English
In the meantime you can open the Help with “odt” extension with Open Office and translate the text with Google.
Bye
Livio
Rispondo pubblicamente a due domande d Luciano che possono interessare a tutti.
QUESTION
Sul Geiger Adapter il diodo D11 (bas321) a cosa serve? And’ necessario?
REPLY
I diodi D11 e D12 servono per evitare danni nel caso che le connessioni del Jack siano sbagliate
(positivo al posto della massa o scambiato con il segnale etc…)
Also if you put the Jack with the master already connected and powered it can happen that, for a brief moment, the positive contact the signal.
Until now, Thanks to these two diodes, It never broke a GeigerAdapter (nor a Master) so much so that I'm pondering about giving a kind of “Lifetime warranty” I mean: fix personally each module Thereminico broken, without charge (Apart from, Of course, shipping costs and the cost of the PIC, If someone from the 220)
Keep in mind though that I am just a designer passionate about electronics and not Center anything with companies that produce the modules, our site is fully “No profit”, “Freeware” and “Open Source”. Someone's got to produce the modules, but it's not us.
QUESTION
You can connect the master two geiger?
I saw that the HAL is available only a fast counter that I've already set on the pin 1.
REPLY
To attach more’ Geiger do so:
– For the geiger from “job” use the FastCounter
– For geiger from “surveillance”, that measure the radioactivity in the environment, use “Counter” normal
The “Fast counter” arrive in 50 MHz and “do not lose a shot” even if you are in the core of a reactor
The “Counter” may come about in 2 KHz but it is better not to use them beyond a few hundred CPS because, given the random nature of the pulses range, When Captain two pulses very close together, the “Counter” loses one.
Pulse rate up to 100cps lost by “Counter” cannot be measured and we are already at levels of radiation 200 fold the bottom, so for environmental monitoring are just fine.
——————-
There is only one Master FastCounter but the HAL to bear at will.
For which, in the event that you have more “Fast conter”, It would add more “Master” or “Slaves” of type “Servant”.
If you link multiple masters and Slaves, the program list them all in the main list HAL, one after the other and can communicate with any software (as you are used to it now), but also among them.
——————-
For geiger speed doesn't count, but for process control applications, requiring a rapid reaction, instead of many Slaves might be better to use many Master.
– The masters have the advantage of not having serial, but each from a separate USB and can therefore travel at 500 FPS constant, Although colleagues 8 the same USB slipper.
– The slaves have the advantage that it can be attached in Master serial, You can also stretch the serial for kilometers and have 10 Pin. Though more and more exchanges are used for second pin flag, given that pass all on the same serial. The maximum serial goes to 2 Megabits/sec, and must be slowed if long lines.
Hello
Livio
Thanks for the alarm level setting change, and the othe information. Have made use of the information, and I downloaded and I am using the latest Geiger Counter software.
Demonstrated it at a club I belong to, plus wrote an article about using the Geiger Kits and software for testing.
Luciano asked me:
Have you tried to use geiger paired with ttl converter-usb? as acts?
Answer him publicly because it can affect everyone.
Until now I didn't even know existed USB converters – TTL, I went to see on eBay that cost money and I found three types:
https://www.theremino.com/files/Conv_USB_TTL_1.png
https://www.theremino.com/files/Conv_USB_TTL_2.png
https://www.theremino.com/files/Conv_USB_TTL_3.png
You won't save a lot, costing ten Euros (a few dollars less than a Master) and they give you very little, a channel just doing one thing. (only one input TTL against six configurable Input-Output 20 types of Master pin)
Should work but are unreliable, You must go to retrieve data from a virtual serial port and then send them to the slots with a Bridge, with all the difficulties and the resulting instability.
If you try them let me know how it goes, they might even be too slow and lose impulses because, given the randomness of radioactive disintegrations, even if radioactive materials are measured shortly and there are few pulses per second, often arrive two pulses are very close. Just a very fast hardware counter, like those of the modules thereminici, that count up to 50 MHz can give you the security of never losing pulse.
We tested a homemade geiger tab + master master powered DIL dil theremino with excellent results .
Currently.
Safe detection station Rome casilino homebuilt geiger + Master dil
Observation station Marino Center until 26/02 DIY GEIGER + usb-ttl converter observation station Marino centro from 27/02 Master-DIL teremino geiger.
I am testing In other tabs.
The data is online at digitalbyte
As far as my experience about costs ? teremino geiger + Master Dil = unbeatable price 40 Euro high quality, no welding,No trimmers,No hardware configuration, you connect it and it works.
I've got a drawer full of homemade cards bought on ebay and .
Have you already bought a geiger or/if home made?
You can use it safely in pairs with a ttl-usb converter, or better with master teremino dil.
Of course with geiger teremino Software v 4.6
Luciano wrote me that in his laboratory measurement 250 NS/h and that instead the open extent 120 NS/h. And he also told me that the walls of the laboratory are composed of Tuff blocks.
Reply:
I have a room that instead of the usual 90 NS/h marks around 130 NS/h, and are the tiles, I had to escort and I measured. In the cellar I found some who arrive in 280 NS/h
Try to measure the tile and the walls by putting the loop very close. Probably though, If all the walls and the floor they emit the same way, also approaching the geiger the measure won't change much. Where the best fit is the one you have already done, measure the open and then into the room, If necessary repeat it with care and with a few hours.
Luciano asked:
How do I add a rain gauge monitoring network?
If I wanted to measure the radon it takes a probe to Alpha Rays?
I read around that you can use a pipe and a small fan putting a filter on the pipe you leave for a few days and then is measured in a gamma counter filter/beta. :-)
I advice without spending a lot? (I have already 3 Geiger and three Theremino Master)
Dear Luciano,
Thanks again for the environmental monitoring network that you did for all of us on the site “digitalbyte”
We hope that many adhere soon, Hopefully we will complete even with rain gauges and Radon.
Measure the mm of rainfall
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You should find, or do, a rain gauge as weather stations.
Ask to Alexis as you make.
Here you can see an experiment of Alessio: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=URBuQfaIDUk
Similar rain gauges are also found on eBay.
Then connect the output to a Master Pin configured as simple Counter.
When you have everything in place and running tell me and we'll add the reading of rain in software ThereminoGeiger (in less than one day – guaranteed)
Radon
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The method with the fan and filter (trap for radon) It's uncomfortable, unreliable and inaccurate.
The measured value depends on the filter time, measurement time, the amount of air the fan will switch in the filter, the density of the filter, the air humidity, the amount of recirculated air (Air already filtered the steel remains by aspirating fan) and the material that makes up the filter.
The measure also takes place… in tugs
– put the filter on the fan and wait a certain number of hours
– Unplug the filter and you put it on geiger and measure for some time
As if that wasn't enough, the radioactive material that is located on the filter decade while the measure, why you should even make a correction than the integration time used.
Because the method of filter-trap is much used?
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The usual commercial Geiger as the Gamma Scout are insensitive and fail to measure environmental radon directly.
Why just concentrating on radioactive material in a filter you can measure something.
How to measure Radon via Master, USB and ThereminoGeiger
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Soon we will publish the RadonAdapter which is a simple form, to attach directly to a master Pin.
The connection takes place with the usual three-wire standard cable, that can be as long as desired, even kilometers.
As a simple Pin Type “Counter”, present on all pins, then a Master can collect up to six.
Furthermore Radon has exceptional characteristics Adapter:
– is very accurate
– requires no calibration
– measure directly the number of disintegrations per liter
– provides a continuous measurement (without collecting and measuring cycles)
– working alone (without manual intervention)
– It's simple to build (simpler than the GeigerAdapter and PmtAdapter)
– dirt cheap
The RadonAdapter contains only components cheap and easy to find, to which anyone can build it DIY, with a few euros.
Hello
Livio
As for radon should I get this worm …. I am sure that the detection is positive in my house at least in the cellar and basement.
We come to the measures in the House 349 NS/h near the wall of Tuff ,244 NS/h freestanding, ,150 NS/h on the roof (8 Mt from the ground about).
I saw the design of Alessio (ik5pwr) robba by Emmett Brown :-) ,to me just an icon on the software and you on the server , a simple sensor bathing on the roof ,a simple thing just to know it was raining at the time of detection or not,Maybe we put the temperature that is important also with a simple resistive probe .
In this way we can put on the roof the geiger,temperature probe,rain detector,and so with a telephone cable 4 couples we bring all the masters with in house.
The RadonAdapter? Why don't you send me the diagram of the project so I start to burn some component? …. :-)
I take this opportunity to thank you publicly for the great job you do and also of the exceptional free support you offer you all of the team theremino.
.
The project of Alessio takes the rain from a funnel of known diameter outdoor.
Then with a small tube bring water to rocker that gives you tot. pulses for every few. cubic centimetres of water.
Count impulses and you “exactly” the mm of rain per hour.
And’ one of the easiest ways to do it.
On eBay there are already facts
Don't send you the draft Radon Adapter because it is not finished.
We're ristudiandolo to get the best features and the utmost simplicity
If you want to experiment you can download the file of evidence of Alessio which is on this page…
Press CTRL-F and search: RadonDetector
“The RadonAdapter? Why don't you send me the diagram of the project so I start to burn some component? …. :-)”
That was a joke Livio……
Apart from the joke, you could really take the pattern of Alessio and do some testing too, I'm not far ahead of what he published Alessio, basic schemes there are, the explanations also…